Suggestion Smaller server issues - esp Tegan and Balor

Discussion in 'General Archive' started by Allogeneous, Dec 24, 2015.

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  1. I think it's fair to say that most/all players who are based on Tegan or Balor servers in particular have problems finding groups for dungeon runs and finding PvP matches a lot of the time. And the pending guild wars will be non-starters. Things generally pick up during events, but it can be difficult to find groups even then.

    So... what can be done about it? Some obvious solutions are:
    1) Allow server migration
    2) Merge the smaller servers. Tegan and Agathon are obvious choices, but who would Balor (perma-PvP) merge with?
    3) Encourage new players to set up camp on those servers and/or do more to encourage player activity on those servers.

    Server Migration
    This has been closely considered by Big Point for some time now. The last we heard, it was in the later stage of the design phase and had the support of the internal team. On the face of it, it is a good solution - let the players who wish to move, move. But it could be the final nail in the coffin for the smaller servers if most of the moving is done from, and not to, those servers.

    Merge the smaller servers
    There would be few negatives in merging Tegan with Agathon. Probably some English speaking players from the English-dominant Tegan server would gripe about the amount of Spanish spoken amongst the Agathon players, but they'd get over it... eventually. But what about Balor? It is uniquely perma-PvP. Also, a lot of DSO players are closet drama queens - sort of like a Henny Penny on crack. They'd see any server mergers as "evidence" that DSO was doomed and run for the hills attired in their best tinfoil dresses.

    Encourage new players and encourage greater player participation on the smaller servers
    Abso-freakin'-lutely perfect, in my humble opinion. But how. That's the million-dollar (or Euro) question. Have I used enough clichés yet? Never!!!
    Options include:
    Server-specific bonuses
    e.g. 1 Players on Balor gain 2* Honour Points for all PvP matches. In itself, this may not seem like an incentive. But it would be if coupled with server migration and, if the players stayed on Balor for at least one month, they could take those Honour Points with them to another server of their choice.
    e.g. 2 The smaller servers get the occasional event specifically for them. It would be unreasonable to expect BP to design a new event just for the smaller servers, but there could be more frequent re-runs of some popular events for those servers
    e.g. 3 Some items unique to the smaller servers such as a mount or costume (no, not a Noddy/Dunce cap). These could be given as rewards for the server-specific event reruns per e.g. 2 above.
    e.g. 4 Competitions in the forum/FB specifically for Tegan/Balor activity - e.g. send an image of your character on that server fighting a particular boss or participating in an event run while grouped

    Free moving truck service
    Assuming that server migration comes at a price (and that would be a safe bet), make it free for players to shift to Tegan or Balor. If they stick around for at least a month, it is free for them to move out again if they wish to. A "no-risk trial".
    Freebies!
    Give all players who set up on Tegan or Balor a nice little extra lovin' in their welcome package


    If you're still reading this... awesome! Thank-you for your time and attention. Even if you think the above ideas/suggestions are utter crap, please post your comments and, more importantly, your own suggestions below.

    Please understand:

    ~ this is a "semi-official" thread at the most. It is not instigated by Big Point, but by yours truly after reading a lot of player feedback here in the forum and also from concerns expressed in Support tickets
    ~ the suggestions above are just that - a few suggestions. If you don't like them: great. Nothing is anywhere near final yet. Lets hear your own.
    ~ no-one wants to take away from the larger servers - just make the smaller ones viable.
    ~ this is not an official feedback thread. You can wander/ramble a little. You are very welcome to disagree with opinions (please state why). But kindly keep it civil.

     
    sebastian_fl and crazyelli like this.
  2. Darwarren

    Darwarren Count Count

    Anything that improves game play is welcome, but this would probably be just a hiccough for most players.
    If separate staffing is involved for the servers, put the excess where they can only do minimal harm.
    This probably will happen anyway, just some paper shuffling in a paperless world.

    Note: The Decline of MMOs Prof. Richard A. Bartle University of Essex United Kingdom has some smarts about what is going on. Check out http://mud.co.uk/richard/The Decline of MMOs.pdf for the details.

    Another article is worth a read as well. Massivity: Have We Simply Outgrown the MMORPG? at http://pc.gamespy.com/articles/122/1225088p1.html

    Question: Are there any real service differences between Tegan and Agathon? Sure, the homey regional attitude is comforting, but the difference should be in milliseconds. All the servers are in California, so Tegan should get a incredibly small edge at best.
     
    Last edited: Dec 31, 2015
  3. sebastian_fl

    sebastian_fl Count Count

    Not that I care about those specific servers even though all the points are valid, but I applause to the idea of gathering and analyzing feedback, shaping it and starting very well structured conversation. I hope you will find all support you need from the community as well as BP team. And I also hope this particular subject is just a beginning of useful practice, and it will be followed by the other topics.

    Sorry for offtop). Good luck
     
  4. Rhysingstar

    Rhysingstar Forum Ambassador

    Wasn't there a rumor of a new North American server just a little while back?

    Tegan is a bit quiet here and there to be honest, so I suspect a good deal of the stronger players would be interested in moving to or at least testing out Agathon at least to see how the pvp is there.

    However, merging or moving servers isn't going to solve all the real "issues" that players complain about most, but I think it could be a good thing in the end.
     
  5. bloodyneo

    bloodyneo Forum Master

    servers merge will be the best solution and the best for u or you will have zillion complains about missing gears, items and points ....spoken languages will be ok.may be time for us to learn something :rolleyes:
     
  6. rpfo

    rpfo Padavan

    Well , if the problem of merging servers is the language , i think most players will be happy on merging. But i do agree before the end decision of merging , all efforts to bring ppl to the low populated servers must be done.
     
  7. sebastian_fl

    sebastian_fl Count Count

    Language shouldn't be a concern. More people, more candidates to speak the same language you do. Wouldn't create any issues at all. If you are on Grimmag, you would see unbelievable number of languages, and it works just fine). I'm sure Heredur speaks every possible language too).
     
    misterbean likes this.
  8. SillySword

    SillySword Regular

    As a Tegan player, I won't play any other server with higher ping value than Tegan. It's Internet network issue. That's all.
     
  9. tonariway

    tonariway Forum Apprentice

    Thanks for all your concerns, Allogeneous.
    Talking about Tegan server, it's an old issue that got worse after 155 release. In my opinion, migration could be the first 'shot', i.e migration between Agathon, Tegan and Balor servers. And second move could be a merge of two servers, if only migration won't work.
    Personally, I reject all the sideways of 'specific thingies'. Certainly it gonna sweeten our gameplay but it won't increase population.

    So please, be realistic if you care about player.
     
  10. Dragonnns

    Dragonnns Count Count

    I have a premium account on Agathon and a F2P account on Tegan. There would have to be some way to address that as clearly, I'd have more than 4 characters if I moved them all to Tegan.

    I think there would also need to be a way to move the premium. I suppose one could wait until it runs out before moving but if someone purchased a package for a year or more (new push for a 24-month deal), that could be problematic.

    I don't think the language is going to be any different than it is now. Agathon has a lot of Spanish/Portuguese speakers. Tegan has a lot of Tagalog and I don't know what all else from the Philippines. It is good to broaden horizons and experience something outside of your normal comfort zone. ;)
     
  11. EhtovK

    EhtovK Old Hand

    In my humble opinion, and as a Tegan player, this most likely would be the final nail in the coffin for Tegan, I disagree with this one.

    English dominant Tegan?, I disagree again, I've met players who speak English, Spanish, Tagalog, Portuguese, Hindi and even Turkish, to say the least, the first 3 being almost equal in quantity, and quite numerous in relation to Tegan's small population; you might be mislead about this because, of course, sometimes the only way for a native Spanish speaker, like myself, to communicate with a member of the Tagalog speaking community is by using our 2nd language, from both sides, wich happens to be english.

    I've been grouped with a lot of these persons for events, and language has never been a barrier for any of us, worst case scenario some of them use the little english they know to make a point; language itself, I can assure you, it's not the main concern of the community when we discuss, because we had, about the posibility of Tegan and Agathon merging, but the number of technical issues this might cause us players, wich we would like to know from your side before boarding the train of "yes, merge the servers now, we love the idea!".

    I remember Haruki stating on a Twitch session that server migration might come with the cost of losing your PvP rank/points, would this be a thing if the servers were to be merged?, will the support give back dissapeared items after the merging if this were to happen?, I've seen this last case happening in other games, merging servers=a lot of missing items for everyone, or, can you assure this won't be an issue for this situation?, what would be the impact on ping for asian and south american players if this was done?, maybe someone more knowledgeable than me can ask even more questions regarding the posibility of merging servers. These are our real interests and the real issues, language is a puny barrier nowadays.

    Also, what would happen with players like him?:
    Is there a way to make those into 2 separate accounts, for example?, what other solutions you could offer to this?

    I'm not sure about this one being good, I've heard rants in Tegan about "Heredur gets everything!" after some twitch or FB raffles, so this might end up being unpleasant and raise rage in other servers by reversing the situation to "Tegan/Agathon gets everything!", of course on a selfish and personal level I would love it, extra goodies are always welcome, but I think this might raise discontent on other servers and would help little to improve the small server's situation.

    About the "no-risk trial", my guess is that a least 80-90% of the people using it will go back to their original servers as soon as they can avoid the price or will try to move servers regularly since they would have nothing to lose. The freebies, or welcome package, it would need a super big ad on the server selection screen and the rewards would need to be more than decent, this might work and it would be something difficult/impossible to abuse for older players.

    There's also the posibility of implementing an "open/closed for new accounts" system on servers, like closing the most populated servers for new accounts during a season and leaving the less populated ones open, until they reach some kind of balance in their number of active players, and of course toggling between open and closed wisely enough to keep all servers healthy.

    As for Balor, I don't know about this server's situation at all, so I'll refrain from commenting on it, and a reminder that these are all my personal opinions and points of view.
     
  12. MegaNuker

    MegaNuker Forum Ambassador

    Small server fixes.

    BEFORE server migration...

    2x the initial Aderment 1,200 very 600 for creating a new account.
    Legendary Weapon for the 5 day bonus vrses extrodanary.
    Legendary item for 9x the effort vrs Extro for 3x the effort. (not cyclable) ie what you get is what you have to do.

    Admins play with Toons and help them with quests.
    IE Admins will be on Tegan server and will provide help for 20 people killing Grimmag. Level 20-25 4 people Level 25-30 4 people Level 35-40 4 people level 40-45 4 people level 45-50 4 people.
    Date 3.3.2016


    After server Migration

    Each server has a difficulty setting. Teagan is 75% Other services ers are 100% Anderment drops off mobs are increased by %. Migration to the small servers will be the same fee. From the server is also same fee.

    Migrating from a large server you keep your premuim. If you migrated to a small server and want to migrate off then you loose premium on the toons you migrate off. If your first move is off a small server you keep premium.

    If the small servers get to small then provide a free migration.

    Small servers receive releases first. And the Thinclient can become a new type. Where when launched you pick your server first and then login. If the server you pick needs an update it will update like it has been...


    Please note that Agathon and Tegan are in the same physical location.

    EDIT:

    On small servers give premium rewards on a certain day of the week. It could be a daily event. People with premium will get 500 anderment that day instead of 100.
     
    Last edited: Jan 6, 2016
  13. .oligark.

    .oligark. Forum Apprentice

    Balor PvP

    The current state of PvP is embarrassing and not getting any better over time.

    I have a simple proposal: marketing. Remove the Balor server from the second tab and place it onto the first screen. Change the flag from EU to a global symbol so that it appears more inclusive and diverse. You will already find players from the European nations, Asia and the Americas.

    If removing its perma-PvP status will increase the population, then I propose that could be a possible solution. Very few people use the wilderness as hunting grounds for other players and the newest maps (level 45+) are not even PvP viable. *hint* nobody cares.

    If you want to give new players freebies, I would like in on this deal, but I don't see that being a long-term solution.

    Is cross-server PvP match an option? That would scratch an itch that for many players.
     
    Darwarren likes this.
  14. marhun

    marhun Junior Expert

    My 2 bobs worth many ppl dont particularly care about the language on tegan we have ppl with poor english but we all try and accommodate everyone. basically something needs to be very soon to fix this issue i think the more developers think about it the more players will be lost. The other thing you need to keep in mind if player to come back will your server capacity be able to cope. We see a drop in the games performance whenever there is a nice new event, usually is accompanied by lag, so this will need to be dealt with before any merge takes place. Please make a decision and save our server (guilds and friends from extinction)
     
    Troneck86 likes this.
  15. BigPapa

    BigPapa Forum Overlooker

    I see two basic problems with reduced server pop.
    1. PVP matching and delay oin finding matches
    2. Group formation and finding those interested in coordinated PVE

    For problem 1: the best solution is a tech solution--Cross server matching. Everyone that reg's for a specific PVP type should be put in a pool with all people from all servers and games should be hosted on a server meant specifically to host PVP. This would solve many of the issues of level and rank disparity as many more players of equivallant status would be available to be in matches and you would be more likely to find people at your level if you have all players in the game available to fight against. This method has been benchmarked by other MMO's and even have server vs server PVP's, premade team matches with ladders and seasons. I would suggest the Dev's not recreate the wheel here, just do what other games have done well by making pvp non-server specific.

    For Problem 2: This one is complicated because of the geographic need to play on a server as close to your home as possible. Since the North American servers are the ones that are of concern, the implication is that there are just not enough people interested in playing the game in the region to populate the servers. Either reduce the number of servers or do something to attract and retain more people in North America and the Pacific. The market is saturated with competition and either the game needs to improve so word of mouth gets more players, or marketing needs to be ramped up beyond advertising on porn sites and game review sites.
     
    -Skygazer- likes this.
  16. silverseas

    silverseas Count Count

    A small population just encouraged me to play solo, and to build a character and play style capable of soloing (at least most things).
    That said, some kind of action taken to fix the population problem would help a lot, both PvP- and PvE-wise. Maybe I wouldn't get bugged to register 1v1 and sacrifice myself so a friend can do their dailies, or see some people sit in towns and beg for a reallllly long time until someone takes pity and hauls them along. ¬¬

    Funny, there was another MMORPG I used to play that allowed people to freely move between servers. Your character wasn't tied to the server itself. What happened was the people suffering from lag issues would look for an empty world with good ping, or if you wanted to play certain events/activities you would log into a different world. Might be too complex for DSO given it's built on the basis of tying our characters down to a specific server (I'm thinking about how broken friend and guild lists would be if this happened... lolz).

    Tegan becoming a ghost town is very much a reality. I remember during one of the Dragan events when the social server broke, I was shocked to learn there actually were that many people on Tegan. :eek: If server migration is an expensive, semi-permanent-ish feature, then it's pretty much RIP Tegan.

    Complainers will survive. I spent a month in a predominantly Spanish-speaking guild and still don't speak Spanish. :p

    As for the closet drama queens, I thought most left with r155 already. ;D

    If server-specific bonuses of any sort are introduced, I don't think server migration (esp. the ability to move more than once) should be permitted. Otherwise you'll have people uprooting from the euro servers, moving in to farm whatever they want, then moving right back out.

    While it would solve the "lack of people to farm with" problem, I am wondering if it's a band-aid solution. You'd have a steady influx of people in to use it for farming every now and then; then they'd move right back out to go back to playing with their old buddies on their original servers. Oh, and all the people on that server that they came from that cannot/will not move will shriek it's unfair. xD

    Granted, if some people stay, for whatever reasons, it may help out with the population problem. But that will depend so much on each individual who chooses to move, it's hard to say what will happen.

    Edit: Just wanted to add that I really think bonuses would just be a band-aid solution. It would actually mirror what happened irl in my province. Oil prices skyrocketed (ie. like the server-specific bonuses), tons of people moved here to work. Now as oil prices are slumping (ie. if the server-specific bonuses were taken away), people just flee back to where they came from, and take with them all the wealth they had accumulated in that time.
     
    Last edited: Dec 31, 2015
    -Skygazer-, Troneck86 and BigPapa like this.
  17. marhun

    marhun Junior Expert

    So Allogeneous,
    Where are we standing now decisions need to be made, there is nothing happening and tegan server is dying. U have the official statistics i dont but my feeling is there is less and less people playing daily. I am not sure what you mean by the cost of joining the servers is it a absolute money cost. People say the servers are int he same physical location if that is the case i am not sure what the cost would be.
    Today at 3pm Eastern australian daylight saving time (so ppl in USA/asia will still be online) there is no pvp and only 3 teams at the PW city of Cardhun.... The server is hanging on by a threat. While these smaller servers dont have the critical mass as other bigger servers that can handle 10% of the server not logging in for weeks tegan cant handle this. In addition it seems from other ppl comments that some items and drop rate is lower on the smaller servers and all items arent the same. If this is the case then the developers and the head honchos need to take some blame for the falling of the game...
    I dont think it is that hard to develop new sets and set combination bonus's, monthly boss bonus's. It like they say in the movies not ever man deserves a castle but even man deserves respect and to be treated fairly. I remember the old Parallel worlds cata dropped about 32 ander, now we get 22..... you said this is an improvement.... If the game wants to make more money develop it more and make it more interesting less grind.
    Now back to merge the servers then there will be hopefully enough critical mass then the rest is upto the developers to act before we are at the same situation in a years time....
    PS... I am still waiting for a secure portal 128bit encryption site, then i am happy to pay for my use of this game. I have already been hacked online once and fleeced for $6,000 USD i wont make that some mistake again
     
  18. -Skygazer-

    -Skygazer- Advanced

    Firstly, FINALLY! The server is agonizing which make gameplay on Tegan by far less enjoyable. I, therefore, fully support a movement in the direction of solving this well overdue issue

    A very attractive idea on the surface, and if it was not for risk of "the final nail in the coffin for smaller servers" then it could be the right solution.


    The minimal negative impact solution with positives sides overweighing the negatives by far. Having merged smaller servers would not decrease the existing English speaking population, on the contrary, the merger will bring more English speaking players. The only impact I see here, is the ratio of different language speakers, which is not a massive problem.


    Fantastic, but complex solution. If coupled with server migration, then a time limit to reverse migration should be introduced (i.e 6 months) which would be a filter against exploiting bonuses on smaller servers.

    I actually really like BigPapa's post:
    #1 Solves the PvP problem and gives all of us an opportunity to not only compete with specific server players but with everyone on DSO, which would be outstanding. For hard core PvPers this would be a total paradise where you would never have to wonder about how you would go up against the best of the best on other servers. PvPers are very competitive, as a result, this would also increase company's profits substantially.

    #2 PvE , again, merging smaller server would be a great solution. Perma-PvP Balor server can be easily changed to a normal server and merged, and with cross server PvP matching, Balor players would be pretty happy I imagine.......
     
    Last edited: Jan 2, 2016
    Darwarren, Troneck86 and marhun like this.
  19. cdeepal

    cdeepal Forum Baron

    Here is another suggestion.
    Redesign the game a little bit and merge all servers together.
    There would be one world but physical location of the servers themselves can be in different locations.
    When not in group, players would be placed in maps/instances with lower ping times to reduce lag and give a better playing experience.
    When in a group or when in PvP matches, players would be moved to a physical server determined as to which would give the best performance on average to each player in the group.
     
    Darwarren likes this.
  20. MegaNuker

    MegaNuker Forum Ambassador

    Ok. The problem is that when multiple people are in a group what server are they going to be put on... I have not yet seen a game with multiple server locations 1/2 across the world merge together. The technology does exist but is a nightmare to manage yet alone program.
     
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